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    1. 09-25-2019 09:52 PM #126
      Quote Originally Posted by nemesis099 View Post
      I can't seem to grasp why Ford and Chevy think these 3 row SUVs should cost over $60K!
      Quote Originally Posted by Cabin Pics View Post
      Also, you can buy a brand new Suburban for $45,000-50,000 if you shop around - Not sure where you're getting your info.
      This sounded like a bit of a stretch, so out of curiosity I went to Chevrolet's own web site. I 'built' a shiny new 2019 Suburban as cheaply as possible. It's a 2WD LS (base) model with no extra-cost options whatsoever, and I selected the front bench seat option because it is a $250 credit. Add in destination, and the sticker price is $51,845. The web site then says this model has a $2000 rebate, bringing the cost down to $49,845 before dealer discount.

      So there's your $45k new Suburban. Question is, who is going to buy one so equipped? And what dealer is daffy enough to keep an optionless model like this in stock?

      By comparison, a top-of-the-line Subaru Ascent Touring (AWD) will have an MSRP of +/- $46,500 depending on which accessory options were added to it. While there is no rebate from Subaru, let's just say for conversation's sake that this Ascent will have a similar 'real world sale price' as that stripped Suburban. Why does a top-trim 4WD Suburban cost so much more than an Ascent Touring? Apparently Chevy feels you are getting a lot more vehicle than the Subaru buyer.
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    3. Senior Member Sporin's Avatar
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      09-25-2019 10:17 PM #127
      2020 4Runner gets Toyota Safety Sence-P so it’s an improvement over nothing for sure. My guess is we won’t see the full Suite until we get a new truck.

    4. How do I resize a picture? Cabin Pics's Avatar
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      09-25-2019 11:41 PM #128
      Quote Originally Posted by TurboMinivan View Post
      This sounded like a bit of a stretch, so out of curiosity I went to Chevrolet's own web site. I 'built' a shiny new 2019 Suburban as cheaply as possible. It's a 2WD LS (base) model with no extra-cost options whatsoever, and I selected the front bench seat option because it is a $250 credit. Add in destination, and the sticker price is $51,845. The web site then says this model has a $2000 rebate, bringing the cost down to $49,845 before dealer discount.

      So there's your $45k new Suburban. Question is, who is going to buy one so equipped? And what dealer is daffy enough to keep an optionless model like this in stock?

      By comparison, a top-of-the-line Subaru Ascent Touring (AWD) will have an MSRP of +/- $46,500 depending on which accessory options were added to it. While there is no rebate from Subaru, let's just say for conversation's sake that this Ascent will have a similar 'real world sale price' as that stripped Suburban. Why does a top-trim 4WD Suburban cost so much more than an Ascent Touring? Apparently Chevy feels you are getting a lot more vehicle than the Subaru buyer.
      Instead of looking at the "build your own" on their site, search new inventory at dealerships, the 2WD LT's can be had all day for $44,000-48,000 out the door.

      Obviously they sell a lot more of the better equipped trims, but if I was shopping for one the 2WD LT with cloth, only option being captains seats in the center, would be my bread and butter.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Sold Over Sticker View Post
      You take that fake rich sled back to the toothless masses and rub their stupid meth faces in your success. Do it for me.

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      09-26-2019 01:34 AM #129
      So who is really surprised by this? I mean its a boxier minivan with slightly better offroad cred for less money? Of course its gonna sell. What doesn't sell is actual off road crap like the Borrego.

    6. 09-26-2019 08:37 AM #130
      Quote Originally Posted by TurboMinivan View Post

      By comparison, a top-of-the-line Subaru Ascent Touring (AWD) will have an MSRP of +/- $46,500 depending on which accessory options were added to it. While there is no rebate from Subaru, let's just say for conversation's sake that this Ascent will have a similar 'real world sale price' as that stripped Suburban. Why does a top-trim 4WD Suburban cost so much more than an Ascent Touring? Apparently Chevy feels you are getting a lot more vehicle than the Subaru buyer.
      Turbo 4 vs. V8
      CVT vs. Automatic
      AWD vs. 4WD
      5,000lbs towing (a stretch #) vs. 6300lbs.
      19.9 cubic feet behind 3rd row vs. 39.3 cubic feet behind 3rd row

      🤷*♂️🤷*♂️🤷*♂️

    7. Senior Member Sporin's Avatar
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      09-26-2019 09:03 AM #131
      You are paying by the pound for the big BOF GM SUV's.

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      09-26-2019 09:35 AM #132
      Quote Originally Posted by TurboMinivan View Post
      By comparison, a top-of-the-line Subaru Ascent Touring (AWD) will have an MSRP of +/- $46,500 depending on which accessory options were added to it. While there is no rebate from Subaru, let's just say for conversation's sake that this Ascent will have a similar 'real world sale price' as that stripped Suburban. Why does a top-trim 4WD Suburban cost so much more than an Ascent Touring? Apparently Chevy feels you are getting a lot more vehicle than the Subaru buyer.
      You are getting way more with the Suburban. We just had one as a rental on our vacation for 7 days. We own a Honda Odyssey and a Wrangler. Having 3 kids the Odyssey is great, but it's getting older and we went looking for a possible replacement. We want to get a model with Captain's chairs in the middle. We looked at the Atlas, Ascent, Highlander, Palisade and Traverse. These are simply way smaller than the Suburban/Yukon XL inside, The BOF GMs would work way better for a bigger family. They are expensive new though...
      Last edited by aleksl; 09-26-2019 at 09:37 AM.

    9. Geriatric Member Air and water do mix's Avatar
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      09-26-2019 09:38 AM #133
      Quote Originally Posted by Sporin View Post
      You are paying by the cubic foot for the big BOF GM SUV's.
      Fixed. GM is selling them at those prices because they can. They have something that Kia, Subaru, VW and yes, Toyota can only dream of. High transaction prices with relatively inexpensive to build vehicles.
      Quote Originally Posted by Boyz in da Park
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      09-26-2019 09:47 AM #134
      Saw one of these yesterday, was way more Ford Flex than I expected.

      Meh.
      Quote Originally Posted by Volkl View Post
      My wife wanted a SUV with a manual transmission. I suggested a Wrangler, she said no way, too masculine

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      09-26-2019 09:48 AM #135
      Quote Originally Posted by aleksl View Post
      You are getting way more with the Suburban. We just had one as a rental on our vacation for 7 days. We own a Honda Odyssey and a Wrangler. Having 3 kids the Odyssey is great, but it's getting older and we went looking for a possible replacement. We want to get a model with Captain's chairs in the middle. We looked at the Atlas, Ascent, Highlander, Palisade and Traverse. These are simply way smaller than the Suburban/Yukon XL inside, The BOF GMs would work way better for a bigger family. They are expensive new though...
      Suburban is one of those vehicles where if you need it, it's awesome, if you don't, you're probably much better served with something else.
      Quote Originally Posted by Volkl View Post
      My wife wanted a SUV with a manual transmission. I suggested a Wrangler, she said no way, too masculine

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      09-26-2019 09:52 AM #136
      Quote Originally Posted by TurboMinivan View Post
      This sounded like a bit of a stretch, so out of curiosity I went to Chevrolet's own web site. I 'built' a shiny new 2019 Suburban as cheaply as possible. It's a 2WD LS (base) model with no extra-cost options whatsoever, and I selected the front bench seat option because it is a $250 credit. Add in destination, and the sticker price is $51,845. The web site then says this model has a $2000 rebate, bringing the cost down to $49,845 before dealer discount.

      So there's your $45k new Suburban. Question is, who is going to buy one so equipped? And what dealer is daffy enough to keep an optionless model like this in stock?

      By comparison, a top-of-the-line Subaru Ascent Touring (AWD) will have an MSRP of +/- $46,500 depending on which accessory options were added to it. While there is no rebate from Subaru, let's just say for conversation's sake that this Ascent will have a similar 'real world sale price' as that stripped Suburban. Why does a top-trim 4WD Suburban cost so much more than an Ascent Touring? Apparently Chevy feels you are getting a lot more vehicle than the Subaru buyer.
      I just bought an Ascent Touring. With "VIP Pricing" (trivial to get with a $60 charitable donation) at 2% under invoice, it came to $42.5 plus a $1k destination. Also snagged a $500 loyalty discount (could be substituted for ambassador coupon if you haven't already bought a Subaru relatively recently). It does a pretty good impression of a luxury SUV, though telltale signs do give it away (just a bit more noise, less smooth turbo 4-banger, and a few less than premium interior bits).

      Suburbans are a size class up. Bigger v8 motor, more towing capacity, also much more difficult to maneuver. Parking a Suburban in a most residential garages would be a royal PITA. We don't have any use for the additional space. But like another poster said, if you need a Suburban you need a Suburban. If you don't need the space, it's not worth paying for. If you wanted all of the doo-dads in the Ascent Touring (to the extent available), you'd be looking at a fully loaded Suburban- which gets into the 70k+ sticker range.
      Last edited by Nealric; 09-26-2019 at 09:58 AM.

    13. Member Uber Wagon's Avatar
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      09-26-2019 10:15 AM #137
      Quote Originally Posted by Air and water do mix View Post
      Fixed. GM is selling them at those prices because they can. They have something that Kia, Subaru, VW and yes, Toyota can only dream of.
      Ahem.



      http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20190905000715
      Last edited by Uber Wagon; 09-26-2019 at 10:26 AM.
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      09-26-2019 11:15 AM #138
      Suburban has WAY more towing and a LOT more room behind the 3rd row than these midsizers. The Ascent depends on spec but this entire class is rated for 2,000 to 5,000 lbs. The minimum for a Suburban is 7100 lbs and can be much higher with different configurations. While you might be able to get transactions prices pretty close, we really are talking about 2 completely different sizes of vehicle here.

    15. 09-26-2019 11:24 AM #139
      Quote Originally Posted by Cabin Pics View Post
      Instead of looking at the "build your own" on their site, search new inventory at dealerships, the 2WD LT's can be had all day for $44,000-48,000 out the door.
      That's not an option for me here in the land of 4WD, so I went directly to Chevy's own site.

      And as for my remark about Chevy thinking you are getting more vehicle than the Ascent buyer, I completely agree--you guys are preaching to the choir. I said that mainly to answer nemesis099's question about why GM thinks these need to cost $60k.

      Quote Originally Posted by Sporin View Post
      You are paying by the pound for the big BOF GM SUV's.
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      09-26-2019 12:25 PM #140
      Quote Originally Posted by The_Real_Stack View Post
      Suburban is one of those vehicles where if you need it, it's awesome, if you don't, you're probably much better served with something else.
      Absolutely. I appreciate what it's capable of, but have no personal use for it.


      Quote Originally Posted by Uber Wagon View Post
      Yeah, okay. I don't see those here and doubt they'll be here in any numbers, if at all. The point is that the Suburban is cheap to build and has high transaction prices. Does a 3.0 diesel Kia do that? I don't know, but it certainly doesn't do it here in the U.S.
      Quote Originally Posted by Boyz in da Park
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    17. How do I resize a picture? Cabin Pics's Avatar
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      09-26-2019 01:37 PM #141
      Quote Originally Posted by TurboMinivan View Post
      That's not an option for me here in the land of 4WD, so I went directly to Chevy's own site.

      :
      Ah, so yeah, the cheapest 4WD base Suburban I can find within 250 miles of me (new on the lot) is $51,000 after incentives. If you need or want one, it's a hell of a vehicle for the money.

      If you don't need one, total waste of money.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Sold Over Sticker View Post
      You take that fake rich sled back to the toothless masses and rub their stupid meth faces in your success. Do it for me.

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      09-26-2019 01:39 PM #142
      Quote Originally Posted by Air and water do mix View Post
      Yeah, okay. I don't see those here and doubt they'll be here in any numbers, if at all. The point is that the Suburban is cheap to build and has high transaction prices. Does a 3.0 diesel Kia do that? I don't know, but it certainly doesn't do it here in the U.S.
      I was just trolling (my own thread no less).

      But yeah, Suburbans and Tahoes do really well here in Texas. One that surprised me is the Ford Expedition. Those are selling like hotcakes, and with $62K average transaction price. Too bad they are so unreliable and have tons of initial quality issues. But that still have not stopped sales juggernauht of the new Expedition.

      Surging demand for Expedition and Navigator is driving an increase in production of 20 percent at Ford’s Kentucky Truck Plant in Louisville. Retail sales of the Expedition eight-passenger SUV surged 35 percent and it gained 5.6 percentage points in market segment share last year. Expedition’s average transaction price increased $11,700 and is now $62,700. Navigator sales grew 70 percent in 2018 from 2017, to 17,839 sold, giving Navigator its best sales year since 2007.
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      09-26-2019 01:44 PM #143
      Quote Originally Posted by Cabin Pics View Post
      Ah, so yeah, the cheapest 4WD base Suburban I can find within 250 miles of me (new on the lot) is $51,000 after incentives. If you need or want one, it's a hell of a vehicle for the money.

      If you don't need one, total waste of money.
      Over here we got a few for <$50k. Couple of 4x4s, too (according to listing).
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      09-26-2019 01:48 PM #144
      Quote Originally Posted by GreenandChrome View Post
      Over here we got a few for <$50k. Couple of 4x4s, too (according to listing).
      Yep. If you don't need an LTZ with $18,000 in options they're not a bad value for what you're buying.

      Which is exactly why if we were planning on spending $46xxx on a three row it would be a no brainer to opt for a BOF Chevrolet versus Atlas, Kia, Hyundai, Toyota.

      Loaded Telluride is $47,xxx

      For that same money I can buy something I can actually tow with, comfortably seat 7 adults, AND everyone's luggage. Simply not possible with these CUV three row models.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Sold Over Sticker View Post
      You take that fake rich sled back to the toothless masses and rub their stupid meth faces in your success. Do it for me.

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      09-26-2019 01:53 PM #145
      Quote Originally Posted by Cabin Pics View Post
      Yep. If you don't need an LTZ with $18,000 in options they're not a bad value for what you're buying.

      Which is exactly why if we were planning on spending $46xxx on a three row it would be a no brainer to opt for a BOF Chevrolet versus Atlas, Kia, Hyundai, Toyota.

      Loaded Telluride is $47,xxx

      For that same money I can buy something I can actually tow with, comfortably seat 7 adults, AND everyone's luggage. Simply not possible with these CUV three row models.
      I can do 6 adults, luggage and a Koffler boat in my Atlas.

      But, I'm stuck in an Atlas.
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    22. Member Nealric's Avatar
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      09-26-2019 02:02 PM #146
      Quote Originally Posted by Cabin Pics View Post
      Yep. If you don't need an LTZ with $18,000 in options they're not a bad value for what you're buying.

      Which is exactly why if we were planning on spending $46xxx on a three row it would be a no brainer to opt for a BOF Chevrolet versus Atlas, Kia, Hyundai, Toyota.

      Loaded Telluride is $47,xxx

      For that same money I can buy something I can actually tow with, comfortably seat 7 adults, AND everyone's luggage. Simply not possible with these CUV three row models.
      You can, but it won't fit in your garage and it's going to be a stripper model vs a fully loaded model. If you don't need the space and don't need to tow 7klbs, it doesn't make sense to upsize for the sake of it.

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      09-26-2019 02:11 PM #147
      Quote Originally Posted by Nealric View Post
      You can, but it won't fit in your garage and it's going to be a stripper model vs a fully loaded model. If you don't need the space and don't need to tow 7klbs, it doesn't make sense to upsize for the sake of it.
      Suburban is 224.4" in length, no different than a truck.

      A Tacoma (a small truck, mind you) ranges from 212.3" to 225.5" depending on configuration. Atlas is 198.3", - Which, when put into context, means the Suburban is only 26.1" longer. If you have a garage that can accommodate an Atlas with space leftover, a Suburban should not be a problem.

      Average garage is 20' deep, that leaves 15.6" in front of or behind a Suburban. I'm not saying it would be an easy fit, but it would fit. Most new construction, in my area at least, includes garages 30' in depth for this very reason. New vehicles are huge.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Sold Over Sticker View Post
      You take that fake rich sled back to the toothless masses and rub their stupid meth faces in your success. Do it for me.

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      09-26-2019 02:15 PM #148
      Quote Originally Posted by Cabin Pics View Post
      Yep. If you don't need an LTZ with $18,000 in options they're not a bad value for what you're buying.

      Which is exactly why if we were planning on spending $46xxx on a three row it would be a no brainer to opt for a BOF Chevrolet versus Atlas, Kia, Hyundai, Toyota.

      Loaded Telluride is $47,xxx

      For that same money I can buy something I can actually tow with, comfortably seat 7 adults, AND everyone's luggage. Simply not possible with these CUV three row models.
      And the Chebby is going to be worth a lot 10 years later; try that with any of the others save the Toyota.



      However, that being said, hauling 7 people, lots of luggage, and towing a heavy load are fairly specialized and not necessarily worth anything to people who don't need them. I've said before, if my wife gets a 3-row vehicle, it will just be so she can haul neighbor kids home from cheerleading practice or something. We're not interested in buying the capacity afforded by a Suburban, a Highlander offers what we need 98% of the time.
      Quote Originally Posted by Volkl View Post
      My wife wanted a SUV with a manual transmission. I suggested a Wrangler, she said no way, too masculine

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      09-26-2019 02:20 PM #149
      Quote Originally Posted by The_Real_Stack View Post
      And the Chebby is going to be worth a lot 10 years later; try that with any of the others save the Toyota.



      However, that being said, hauling 7 people, lots of luggage, and towing a heavy load are fairly specialized and not necessarily worth anything to people who don't need them. I've said before, if my wife gets a 3-row vehicle, it will just be so she can haul neighbor kids home from cheerleading practice or something. We're not interested in buying the capacity afforded by a Suburban, a Highlander offers what we need 98% of the time.
      This is America.

      Which is the only reason you need to own a land barge.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Sold Over Sticker View Post
      You take that fake rich sled back to the toothless masses and rub their stupid meth faces in your success. Do it for me.

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      09-26-2019 02:33 PM #150
      Quote Originally Posted by Cabin Pics View Post
      This is America.

      Which is the only reason you need to own a land barge.
      My problem is, I live in a house built in 1958, and has a garage that is decidedly *not* large. My Jeep and wife's RDX fit in at the same time only when I park the Jeep right up against the garage wall and have to back out to let anyone in on the pax side.
      Quote Originally Posted by Volkl View Post
      My wife wanted a SUV with a manual transmission. I suggested a Wrangler, she said no way, too masculine

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