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    1. Member
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      07-12-2019 03:58 PM #1
      So we have yet another child on the way and need something larger. Come October we'll have 2 rear facing car seats and a booster and I already know minivan is the right answer . This is replacing a 2017 Mercedes E300.


      Anyways requirements are

      3 Rows (prefer Captains for easy 3rd row access)
      Looking to spend $40-65K
      > 6K Lbs GVWR for tax purposes

      So far i'm considering a current Gen Tahoe/Yukon, Pilot, & Highlander. Quite frankly none of those excite me, so I'm hoping i'm missing something more interesting.

      From what I can tell the Telluride, Atlas, & Ascent don't meet the 6K lb requirement.

      Briefly considered stretching for a new X7 but I really rather not deal with the depreciation.

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    3. Member x(why)z's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 04:16 PM #2
      Quote Originally Posted by Kapoosh1 View Post
      So we have yet another child on the way and need something larger. Come October we'll have 2 rear facing car seats and a booster and I already know minivan is the right answer . This is replacing a 2017 Mercedes E300.


      Anyways requirements are

      3 Rows (prefer Captains for easy 3rd row access)
      Looking to spend $40-65K
      > 6K Lbs GVWR for tax purposes

      So far i'm considering a current Gen Tahoe/Yukon, Pilot, & Highlander. Quite frankly none of those excite me, so I'm hoping i'm missing something more interesting.

      From what I can tell the Telluride, Atlas, & Ascent don't meet the 6K lb requirement.

      Briefly considered stretching for a new X7 but I really rather not deal with the depreciation.
      As boring as it seems, the Highlander is what we chose when in this same predicament. We did so for a number of reasons.
      1. Resale - The highlander has great resale, and I appreciate that in a car that is going to rack up a ton of miles and be used as a family tool.
      2. Reliability - It scores ridiculously well, and that matters when my wife and daughter are constantly driving between Pittsburgh and wherever in western PA winters.
      3. Captains chairs - The second row of the Highlander is so spacious and perfect for my wife and our one year old. The seats recline, and the built-in privacy shades are awesome for when she wants to feed the baby discreetly.
      4. Stealth - It isn't flashy, or showy, but inside it is really great in terms of layout. Ours is the Limited model which ads some niceties. I appreciate the stealth factor in my line of work. It's good to have a vehicle with every feature I could want, but without too much show.
      5. Ride quality - It just rides superbly compared to many of the others we drove.

      I can't recommend it enough. It isn't fun necessarily, but with the upgraded audio system, big sunroofs, captains chairs, and decent V6, it is an amazing highway mile crusher and an obscenely good family car. The only downside is that the third row is best for kids and small adults. It isn't huge back there.

      Also, it leaves room in our budget for me to buy anything I like... Once I figure out what that is.

      Oh yah, I think the Durango may be available with captains chairs and a banging V8! Maybe worth checking.

    4. Member ice4life's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 04:16 PM #3
      Quote Originally Posted by Kapoosh1 View Post
      So we have yet another child on the way and need something larger. Come October we'll have 2 rear facing car seats and a booster and I already know minivan is the right answer . This is replacing a 2017 Mercedes E300.


      Anyways requirements are

      3 Rows (prefer Captains for easy 3rd row access)
      Looking to spend $40-65K
      > 6K Lbs GVWR for tax purposes

      So far i'm considering a current Gen Tahoe/Yukon, Pilot, & Highlander. Quite frankly none of those excite me, so I'm hoping i'm missing something more interesting.

      From what I can tell the Telluride, Atlas, & Ascent don't meet the 6K lb requirement.

      Briefly considered stretching for a new X7 but I really rather not deal with the depreciation.

      The new GLE450 has a GVWR of about 6,500 pounds, and now offers a third row- plus it is in your price range.



    5. Member ice4life's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 04:19 PM #4
      Quote Originally Posted by x(why)z View Post
      As boring as it seems, the Highlander is what we chose when in this same predicament. We did so for a number of reasons.
      1. Resale - The highlander has great resale, and I appreciate that in a car that is going to rack up a ton of miles and be used as a family tool.
      2. Reliability - It scores ridiculously well, and that matters when my wife and daughter are constantly driving between Pittsburgh and wherever in western PA winters.
      3. Captains chairs - The second row of the Highlander is so spacious and perfect for my wife and our one year old. The seats recline, and the built-in privacy shades are awesome for when she wants to feed the baby discreetly.
      4. Stealth - It isn't flashy, or showy, but inside it is really great in terms of layout. Ours is the Limited model which ads some niceties. I appreciate the stealth factor in my line of work. It's good to have a vehicle with every feature I could want, but without too much show.
      5. Ride quality - It just rides superbly compared to many of the others we drove.

      I can't recommend it enough. It isn't fun necessarily, but with the upgraded audio system, big sunroofs, captains chairs, and decent V6, it is an amazing highway mile crusher and an obscenely good family car. The only downside is that the third row is best for kids and small adults. It isn't huge back there.

      Also, it leaves room in our budget for me to buy anything I like... Once I figure out what that is.

      Oh yah, I think the Durango may be available with captains chairs and a banging V8! Maybe worth checking.
      Yeah but they literally just redesigned the highlander, so do you want to be driving an old design vehicle for the next how many ever years? If you're going that route, at least wait for the new one..



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      07-12-2019 04:26 PM #5
      What's this 6k tax planning all about?

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      07-12-2019 04:32 PM #6
      The XC90 meets the 6k GVWR and can now be had with captains chairs. Although if you get the built in center seat booster, two rear facing car seats fit on the outboard seats so you wouldn't need to use the 3rd row for just the 5 of you.
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      07-12-2019 04:41 PM #7
      Quote Originally Posted by x(why)z View Post
      As boring as it seems, the Highlander is what we chose when in this same predicament. We did so for a number of reasons.
      1. Resale - The highlander has great resale, and I appreciate that in a car that is going to rack up a ton of miles and be used as a family tool.
      2. Reliability - It scores ridiculously well, and that matters when my wife and daughter are constantly driving between Pittsburgh and wherever in western PA winters.
      3. Captains chairs - The second row of the Highlander is so spacious and perfect for my wife and our one year old. The seats recline, and the built-in privacy shades are awesome for when she wants to feed the baby discreetly.
      4. Stealth - It isn't flashy, or showy, but inside it is really great in terms of layout. Ours is the Limited model which ads some niceties. I appreciate the stealth factor in my line of work. It's good to have a vehicle with every feature I could want, but without too much show.
      5. Ride quality - It just rides superbly compared to many of the others we drove.

      I can't recommend it enough. It isn't fun necessarily, but with the upgraded audio system, big sunroofs, captains chairs, and decent V6, it is an amazing highway mile crusher and an obscenely good family car. The only downside is that the third row is best for kids and small adults. It isn't huge back there.

      Also, it leaves room in our budget for me to buy anything I like... Once I figure out what that is.

      Oh yah, I think the Durango may be available with captains chairs and a banging V8! Maybe worth checking.
      All of your reasons above are why it's actually way up on my list. My main issue with the highlander is the all new one comes out for 2020...unfortunately that's not until February and we can't wait past November or so. I guess I would still consider one for the right price.

      Quote Originally Posted by ice4life View Post
      The new GLE450 has a GVWR of about 6,500 pounds, and now offers a third row- plus it is in your price range.
      Quote Originally Posted by ice4life View Post
      Yeah but they literally just redesigned the highlander, so do you want to be driving an old design vehicle for the next how many ever years? If you're going that route, at least wait for the new one..
      We did look at one but no captain chairs and really only a GLE350 would fit our budget and i'd like to stay away from the 2.0T engine as I find it underpowered. If we decided to forego the captains this will likely be our choice though.

      Quote Originally Posted by Gitcha Sum View Post
      What's this 6k tax planning all about?
      Section 179, if you have a business,you should look into it, it's currently a great benefit.

      Quote Originally Posted by ND40oz View Post
      The XC90 meets the 6k GVWR and can now be had with captains chairs. Although if you get the built in center seat booster, two rear facing car seats fit on the outboard seats so you wouldn't need to use the 3rd row for just the 5 of you.
      Any idea when the 2020's will hit the lots? We actually drove a T6 2019 and did enjoy it but the dealer said the 2020's wont be here until 2020

      Although with the way they depreciate it seems to make much more sense to go with a year or two old one.

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      07-12-2019 04:45 PM #8
      If I was in this market I would be headed down to Ford for an Expedition Max.

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      07-12-2019 04:45 PM #9
      I guess I should add the following:

      GX460- Felt like a throwback to 10 years ago. Great truck but needs updated.

      And really don't want to spend $50k+ and have it be the "old" body style next year.

    11. Member ice4life's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 04:54 PM #10
      Quote Originally Posted by Kapoosh1 View Post
      Section 179, if you have a business,you should look into it, it's currently a great benefit.
      Section 179 of the IRS tax code allows businesses to deduct the full purchase price of qualifying equipment and/or software purchased or financed during the tax year. That means that if you buy (or lease) a piece of qualifying equipment, you can deduct the FULL PURCHASE PRICE from your gross income. It’s an incentive created by the U.S. government to encourage businesses to buy equipment and invest in themselves. Certain vehicles (with a gross vehicle weight rating above 6,000 lbs. but no more than 14,000 lbs.) qualify for deducting up to $25,000 if the vehicle is purchased and placed in service prior to December 31 and meets other conditions. Vehicles used in your businesses qualify – but certain passenger vehicles have a total deduction limitation of $11,160, while other vehicles that by their nature are not likely to be used more than a minimal amount for personal purposes qualify for full Section 179 deduction
      Are you using this as a business vehicle more than 50% of the time? Because it sounds more like a family hauler.. several years ago the Section 179 deduction was sometimes referred to as the “Hummer Tax Loophole,” because at the time it allowed businesses to buy large SUV’s and write them off. While this particular use of the tax code has been modified with new limits, it is still often abused.

    12. Member ice4life's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 04:57 PM #11
      Quote Originally Posted by Kapoosh1 View Post
      I guess I should add the following:

      GX460- Felt like a throwback to 10 years ago. Great truck but needs updated.

      And really don't want to spend $50k+ and have it be the "old" body style next year.
      FWIW, they did just do another refresh on the GX. It looks very similar, but it is updated





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      07-12-2019 05:01 PM #12
      Quote Originally Posted by Kapoosh1 View Post
      Any idea when the 2020's will hit the lots? We actually drove a T6 2019 and did enjoy it but the dealer said the 2020's wont be here until 2020

      Although with the way they depreciate it seems to make much more sense to go with a year or two old one.
      The 2020's started production in April, your dealer is likely just trying to move their inventory. You can always just order one and go to Sweden and pick it up, it's a great experience.

      2020 build guides: http://www.flyvolvo.com/msg4.htm

      Maybe I'm used to German vehicles but the XC90s value seems to have held up pretty well when I check our trade in values. But comparing it to something like the Highlander, well, it's not a Toyota.
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      07-12-2019 05:22 PM #13
      Quote Originally Posted by ice4life View Post
      Are you using this as a business vehicle more than 50% of the time? Because it sounds more like a family hauler.. several years ago the Section 179 deduction was sometimes referred to as the “Hummer Tax Loophole,” because at the time it allowed businesses to buy large SUV’s and write them off. While this particular use of the tax code has been modified with new limits, it is still often abused.
      It’ll probably be used 80% for business. I fully intend to cart the kids around in the wrangler most of the time but realistically know it’ll be necessary to have a larger car around sometimes.

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      07-12-2019 05:23 PM #14
      Quote Originally Posted by ND40oz View Post
      The 2020's started production in April, your dealer is likely just trying to move their inventory. You can always just order one and go to Sweden and pick it up, it's a great experience.

      2020 build guides: http://www.flyvolvo.com/msg4.htm

      Maybe I'm used to German vehicles but the XC90s value seems to have held up pretty well when I check our trade in values. But comparing it to something like the Highlander, well, it's not a Toyota.
      Well, I clearly should’ve done my research rather than trusting the dealer. This will probably move to the top of my list.


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    16. Member x(why)z's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 05:32 PM #15
      Quote Originally Posted by Kapoosh1 View Post
      All of your reasons above are why it's actually way up on my list. My main issue with the highlander is the all new one comes out for 2020...unfortunately that's not until February and we can't wait past November or so. I guess I would still consider one for the right price.
      I think I'm going to buy the 2020 or 2021. And I feel you on not wanting the older model with the new one coming out. I'm glad I bought it before I even knew the 2020 was all-new.

      I will say that the infotainment on mine feels dated. It looks to have been cured for the new model. Too bad about your timeline! I was going to say a Landcruiser would be sweet, but no captains chairs. I test drove one and it was glorious, but even two years CPO, it was more than I wanted to spend. I think they were asking $68,500... A lot of money, but a hell of a vehicle.

      I checked, and the Durango does come with optional captains chairs. The depreciation, though, at least compared to a Toyota, is kind of rough.

    17. Member MAGICGTI's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 11:30 PM #16
      2020 XC90 T6 has 2nd row captains optional and is over 6k

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      07-13-2019 08:50 AM #17
      OP is living in US of A... stick with GM truck because they worth $$ (specially in USED market). Go euro if you don't like $$$



      Read the article version if don't like to watch youtube
      https://www.autotrader.com/car-video...-market-274345

      This might sound like total nonsense, but it's absolutely true. This is my second GMC truck I've had as a company car, the first being a 2015 Sierra 1500 SLT 4x4. The sticker price was $48,000 -- but it didn't take much bartering at the dealer to get $10,000 off that price. After nearly 3 years and 68,000 miles, I traded it in for $31,000 toward the Denali. That's only $7,000 in depreciation -- even though I put tons of miles on it. Before the first Sierra, I owned a 2010 Toyota Prius Opens a New Window. , and I would turn in my mileage for the standard reimbursement of 50 cents per mile. If my soul could have somehow survived driving that Prius for the last 3 years and 68,000 miles, at 50 cents per-mile, the company would have paid out $34,000 during that time. Since the Sierra only depreciated $7,000, when you add that with the taxes on that value lost, along maintenance, fuel and tags/insurance, my fuzzy math calculation comes to $21,500 for the total ownership cost of the Sierra.

      Now, you may be thinking this ridiculously high trade-in value was given just to make me feel better about the Sierra Denali purchase -- but they also discounted the new truck almost $12,000. Once again, this was a fairly normal model-year-end discount that didn't take much negotiation to achieve -- and my old truck quickly hit their pre-owned inventory with an asking price of $35,000. I'm not sure what they sold it for, but I imagine it was a decent profit, as it was gone within a few weeks. This isn't an unusual case, as demand for used trucks is ridiculously high. Currently on Autotrader, the average asking price for a 3-year-old Sierra Denali 4x4 is $39,000 -- and even the decade-old 2008 models still have an average asking price of nearly $20,000.
      Last edited by Avus; 07-13-2019 at 09:01 AM.
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    19. Member lowlight's Avatar
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      07-13-2019 09:06 AM #18
      Quote Originally Posted by Kapoosh1 View Post
      I guess I should add the following:

      GX460- Felt like a throwback to 10 years ago. Great truck but needs updated.

      And really don't want to spend $50k+ and have it be the "old" body style next year.
      ^^^Not wrong, but IMO, that's part of the GX appeal. It's bulletproof. But unless you're turning it into an overland vehicle, you'd probably be missing some features.

      GX460 = overland, put on a rack, sliders, and some all terrain tires

      Nissan Armada or Lexus LX = large people hauler with more reliability & style than GM twins

      Durango SRT = fast & large, might be only option with any real "excitement"

      Those would be choices for a pre-owned 3 row SUV in 40-60K range.
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    20. 07-13-2019 10:29 AM #19
      I can't believe nobody has mentioned it, but if you can get over the Capt chair requirement, buy a current gen Q7. Nothing even approaches it for the money, new or used. It is an absolutely stellar SUV. You should be able to easily find an 18 or 19 CPO Prestige for under 65K. It's honestly so good there's nothing else I'd even cross-shop it with unless I needed to do off roading on a semi-regular basis.
      Last edited by PrettyHateMachine; 07-13-2019 at 10:32 AM.

    21. Member ice4life's Avatar
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      07-15-2019 10:07 AM #20
      Quote Originally Posted by PrettyHateMachine View Post
      I can't believe nobody has mentioned it, but if you can get over the Capt chair requirement, buy a current gen Q7. Nothing even approaches it for the money, new or used. It is an absolutely stellar SUV. You should be able to easily find an 18 or 19 CPO Prestige for under 65K. It's honestly so good there's nothing else I'd even cross-shop it with unless I needed to do off roading on a semi-regular basis.
      They just refreshed the Q7. If the op is annoyed about that on the Highlander, I imagine the same sticks here given his time constraints.



    22. 07-15-2019 11:15 AM #21
      Quote Originally Posted by ice4life View Post
      They just refreshed the Q7. If the op is annoyed about that on the Highlander, I imagine the same sticks here given his time constraints.
      I am aware of the refresh on the Q7. It is just that- a refresh, not an all-new model. Some differently shaped lights and bumpers, new touch screen MMI, and the turbo V6 is replacing the supercharged V6. Nothing so major it's necessary waiting for, and it's still so superior to anything else in its class it's not even funny.

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      07-15-2019 01:42 PM #22
      Quote Originally Posted by PrettyHateMachine View Post
      I am aware of the refresh on the Q7. It is just that- a refresh, not an all-new model. Some differently shaped lights and bumpers, new touch screen MMI, and the turbo V6 is replacing the supercharged V6. Nothing so major it's necessary waiting for, and it's still so superior to anything else in its class it's not even funny.
      Frankly, I don't find the discounts to be large enough to be driving a pre-refresh model. Other than that my wife did love the Q7. I do have some hope that the discounts will get larger the closer we get to the new model coming out but also it still doesn't have bucket seats in the 2nd row.

      I drove a hybrid Platinum model Highlander yesterday. Overall a very nice car but I couldn't stand the CVT transmissions, unfortunately the salesperson told me the regular V6 also has a CVT so I didn't drive one Quick google search this morning shows that the V6 has a 6 speed automatic. Don't understand how some sales people lack such basic knowledge about what they're selling.

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      07-15-2019 01:45 PM #23
      Quote Originally Posted by lowlight View Post
      ^^^Not wrong, but IMO, that's part of the GX appeal. It's bulletproof. But unless you're turning it into an overland vehicle, you'd probably be missing some features.

      GX460 = overland, put on a rack, sliders, and some all terrain tires

      Nissan Armada or Lexus LX = large people hauler with more reliability & style than GM twins

      Durango SRT = fast & large, might be only option with any real "excitement"

      Those would be choices for a pre-owned 3 row SUV in 40-60K range.
      I get the appeal of the GX for a toy/offroading/adventures etc. but I already have the Wrangler for all that kind of stuff.

      Might look at the Durango. We looked at the LX570 and both liked it a lot but $60K doesn't buy you a great 16+ model.

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      07-15-2019 01:56 PM #24
      Looking at AutoTrader, there are still leftover 2018 Durange SRT's available for under $60k. Depreciation may not even be that bad (for a domestic SUV), since it's sort of a unique vehicle.

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      07-15-2019 02:11 PM #25
      Quote Originally Posted by Kapoosh1 View Post
      So we have yet another child on the way and need something larger. Come October we'll have 2 rear facing car seats and a booster and I already know minivan is the right answer .
      Seems like a minivan or full size van is the answer to your stated requirements.

      Try installing a child seat in the third row, and try strapping the kid in the child seat in the third row before buying. Third rows of SUVs may be ok for small children who can climb in and buckle themselves in, but can be difficult if an adult needs to assist.

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