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    1. Junior Member nc_detail_garage's Avatar
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      07-11-2019 05:33 PM #126
      Quote Originally Posted by vwlifer27 View Post
      So, I just had my 2019 GTI professionally coated. Single stage paint correction, then coating. It looks great, but of course I missed a large rock chip on my lower rocker. It's so low that you need to get on your hands and knees to see it. Its a deep pit.

      I am wondering if because its so deep the coating didn't actually get in there and I will be able to touch it up? I just do not want any rust popping up from the chip.

      My installer said that any existing rock chips will be fine as the ceramic coating will seal it up as if it was a 'clear coat'. I have been reading online however, that chemicals in ceramic coating will interact with in treated rock chips and cause 'damage' (however that is just one article I read, haven't seen anything else that says this). He said it wont cause something to rust.

      Thoughts? I'm guessing I can carefully touch up any new paint chips in the future (carefully as to only get touch up on the bare metal and not the surrounding coating)?

      Lastly, the coating he put on is good for 5 years. If I still have the car at that point and choose not to get it put on again, can I just start waxing like I normally would or do I need to get another polish/correction?

      He also missed a scratch on the clear coat prior to the ceramic coat. He is going to stop back out and redo that area. I don't blame him for missing it, its right on a leading edge of a door and it looks like it could just be light hitting it, but its actually a scratch. A weird one at that.

      I am bummed as this car is only a month old and 1222 miles and already has a giant pit and a scratch (which I don't know how it got there).
      I would touch up the chip if it made it all the way through to the metal. Ceramic is super thin and won't provide the same benefits as clear.

      The coating will obviously degrade over time and 5 years is the manufacturer's suggested life. I'm assuming you should have a warranty card if a pro did it. Realistically, your paint will be swirled in five years and will need to be corrected again if it bothers you. Otherwise, just go about your life and apply whatever protection choice.

      There isn't a definitive means to tell if the coating is still present beyond the water behavior. Ceramic can get 'clogged' and in a relatively short amount of time depending on conditions. Typically a good wash with proper soap and an annual iron-x will properly cleanse the paint to rejuvenate the ceramic if you notice the water behavior starting to fade. I do a more serious 'topper' every six months after a iron removal treatment for my sanity. I'm going on year 2 of 5 w/ my feynlab ceramic.

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    3. Member vwlifer27's Avatar
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      07-11-2019 08:13 PM #127
      Quote Originally Posted by nc_detail_garage View Post
      I would touch up the chip if it made it all the way through to the metal. Ceramic is super thin and won't provide the same benefits as clear.

      The coating will obviously degrade over time and 5 years is the manufacturer's suggested life. I'm assuming you should have a warranty card if a pro did it. Realistically, your paint will be swirled in five years and will need to be corrected again if it bothers you. Otherwise, just go about your life and apply whatever protection choice.

      There isn't a definitive means to tell if the coating is still present beyond the water behavior. Ceramic can get 'clogged' and in a relatively short amount of time depending on conditions. Typically a good wash with proper soap and an annual iron-x will properly cleanse the paint to rejuvenate the ceramic if you notice the water behavior starting to fade. I do a more serious 'topper' every six months after a iron removal treatment for my sanity. I'm going on year 2 of 5 w/ my feynlab ceramic.
      Will the touchup even bond over the ceramic? It’s deep so can’t be sure if the coating made it all the way in, but if it did, will it bond?

    4. Member Bad Rabbit Habit's Avatar
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      07-11-2019 09:41 PM #128
      This is relevant to my current situation. I do have a big twist though. I want to do my rabbit, which is covered in rock chips that have rusted over. Plus, there is old vinyl strips, also in poor condition. The picture is of the roof, but the rest of the car is similar. I know with a buff, all the little specks will disappear, but I am curious how a coating will react to the bigger spots. Also, the vinyl will be impossible to mask, so if that is a problem, this will be a non starter.

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    5. Member vwlifer27's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 04:37 AM #129
      Quote Originally Posted by Bad Rabbit Habit View Post
      This is relevant to my current situation. I do have a big twist though. I want to do my rabbit, which is covered in rock chips that have rusted over. Plus, there is old vinyl strips, also in poor condition. The picture is of the roof, but the rest of the car is similar. I know with a buff, all the little specks will disappear, but I am curious how a coating will react to the bigger spots. Also, the vinyl will be impossible to mask, so if that is a problem, this will be a non starter.

      I’m digging the look of your Rabbit.

    6. Junior Member nc_detail_garage's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 09:27 AM #130
      That's a tricky one. I would be careful on this one, especially using an orbital as it'll pick up and rub around the rust particles. Unfortunately I would not try and correct the paint if you brought it to me for a service. At best I would try and remove all the surface rust via multiple iron removal treatments and clay. After that I would use touch up paint to address the worse spots and move on. Keep in mind that you'll want to super careful not to grind the rust around, thus further damaging the paint.

      Same story for the vinyl stripes. They will not polish like paint and you'll likely just remove the top layer of the vinyl.

      There's nothing wrong with doing a diy ceramic but if it were my car I would just keep it simple and use paint sealants. Or, take a look at Gyeon CanCoat. I get about 7 sedans out of the 200ml bottle which makes it very cost effective. It's rated for 6 months with proper maintenance.

    7. Junior Member nc_detail_garage's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 09:31 AM #131
      Quote Originally Posted by vwlifer27 View Post
      Will the touchup even bond over the ceramic? It’s deep so can’t be sure if the coating made it all the way in, but if it did, will it bond?
      Best case, put a tiny amount of compound on a q tip and rub the chipped area. If not, then just use what you have and put touch up paint on. Use small amounts and build layers w/ the paint but since it's so low on the body panel I wouldn't over think it. Ceramic isn't this wonder solution that unfortunately the industry has made it out to be. I've removed many coatings from various manufacturers with light polishing despite claims of wet sanding and very heavy compounding is needed.

    8. Member vwlifer27's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 11:11 AM #132
      Quote Originally Posted by nc_detail_garage View Post
      Best case, put a tiny amount of compound on a q tip and rub the chipped area. If not, then just use what you have and put touch up paint on. Use small amounts and build layers w/ the paint but since it's so low on the body panel I wouldn't over think it. Ceramic isn't this wonder solution that unfortunately the industry has made it out to be. I've removed many coatings from various manufacturers with light polishing despite claims of wet sanding and very heavy compounding is needed.
      Thanks for the reply. My detailer said that it would be pointless to put it on as it won't bond. This is encouraging news. I lived in NC (was born there, but only lived there for the first few years of my life), I would be coming to you. I checked out your site and you run a cool business.

    9. Junior Member nc_detail_garage's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 02:13 PM #133
      Quote Originally Posted by vwlifer27 View Post
      Thanks for the reply. My detailer said that it would be pointless to put it on as it won't bond. This is encouraging news. I lived in NC (was born there, but only lived there for the first few years of my life), I would be coming to you. I checked out your site and you run a cool business.
      If it were me, I would either take it back to your detailer and have him rub out the ceramic from ding and apply touch up. It's a five minute task. Or, just apply the touch up yourself and be done with it. You'll know within a few minutes when the paint is dry whether or not it's going to bond. My money is that i'll stick just fine.

      And thank you for the kind words. I detail part-time for fun, a couple cars a month.

    10. Member HorrorPunk's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 05:43 PM #134
      I've been thinking about getting a ceramic coating for my new Charger Scat Pack... found a local place that comes VERY highly recommended & top rated, but they are pricey.

      For $1,800 they will:

      • Hand wash & clay wax
      • Repair ALL scratches & chips with factory paint
      • Apply 4 individual layers of Ceramic Pro coating
      • Apply 1 layer of Ceramic Pro light as a top final sealing coat
      • Apply 1 layer Ceramic Pro light to all exterior plastics
      • Apply 1 layer of Ceramic Pro to wheels & brake calipers
      • Apply 1 layer of Ceramic Pro leather/textile to seats
      • Vehicle reported to CARFAX (which can supposedly increase your cars value)
      • "LIFETIME" warranty, which covers fixing ANY scratches and chips as long as you own the car for, FREE.



      I've called a handful of other places around LA and they all quote around $500 for ONE layer or $800 for TWO layers of Ceramic coating, but non offer free scratch/chip repair work.

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      07-13-2019 12:58 PM #135
      Quote Originally Posted by HorrorPunk View Post
      For $1,800 they will:

      • Hand wash & clay wax
      • Repair ALL scratches & chips with factory paint
      • Apply 4 individual layers of Ceramic Pro coating
      • Apply 1 layer of Ceramic Pro light as a top final sealing coat
      • Apply 1 layer Ceramic Pro light to all exterior plastics
      • Apply 1 layer of Ceramic Pro to wheels & brake calipers
      • Apply 1 layer of Ceramic Pro leather/textile to seats
      • Vehicle reported to CARFAX (which can supposedly increase your cars value)
      • "LIFETIME" warranty, which covers fixing ANY scratches and chips as long as you own the car for, FREE.
      There's a couple things that stand out about this list:

      1. They don't mention anything about paint correction, which is the most labor intensive thing that should be done before applying a ceramic coating.
      2. 4 layers is at least one too many of the same product.

      PS: I've had great experiences with a place in Anaheim. If you want a recommendation, PM me.

    12. Junior Member nc_detail_garage's Avatar
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      Yesterday 09:40 AM #136
      Quote Originally Posted by HorrorPunk View Post
      I've been thinking about getting a ceramic coating for my new Charger Scat Pack... found a local place that comes VERY highly recommended & top rated, but they are pricey.

      For $1,800 they will:

      • Hand wash & clay wax
      • Repair ALL scratches & chips with factory paint
      • Apply 4 individual layers of Ceramic Pro coating
      • Apply 1 layer of Ceramic Pro light as a top final sealing coat
      • Apply 1 layer Ceramic Pro light to all exterior plastics
      • Apply 1 layer of Ceramic Pro to wheels & brake calipers
      • Apply 1 layer of Ceramic Pro leather/textile to seats
      • Vehicle reported to CARFAX (which can supposedly increase your cars value)
      • "LIFETIME" warranty, which covers fixing ANY scratches and chips as long as you own the car for, FREE.



      I've called a handful of other places around LA and they all quote around $500 for ONE layer or $800 for TWO layers of Ceramic coating, but non offer free scratch/chip repair work.
      That's similar to my pricing, assuming a heavy paint correction is included. I hope they didn't use the term repair all scratches. That's an odd way of referencing it. I also hope they have seen the car in person before quoting. Keep in mind the 'lifetime' warranty is contingent upon annual maintenance performed by their shop. I would call and check pricing but it's typically ~$250. I would confirm if they're doing wheels off coating or just the faces. I'm assuming they are but worth checking if the barrels will be coated. That's the real beneficial part.

      Just for more sanity, I have yet to see any empirical evidence that the carfax adds any value. Until then, it's just conjecture

      The biggest part to all this is the maintenance. Ceramic isn't a one and done solution. If you value good paint condition and clarity then it's worth understanding and refining your wash/dry process.
      Last edited by nc_detail_garage; Yesterday at 09:43 AM.

    13. Member HorrorPunk's Avatar
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      Yesterday 03:47 PM #137
      Quote Originally Posted by nc_detail_garage View Post
      That's similar to my pricing, assuming a heavy paint correction is included. I hope they didn't use the term repair all scratches. That's an odd way of referencing it. I also hope they have seen the car in person before quoting. Keep in mind the 'lifetime' warranty is contingent upon annual maintenance performed by their shop. I would call and check pricing but it's typically ~$250. I would confirm if they're doing wheels off coating or just the faces. I'm assuming they are but worth checking if the barrels will be coated. That's the real beneficial part.

      Just for more sanity, I have yet to see any empirical evidence that the carfax adds any value. Until then, it's just conjecture

      The biggest part to all this is the maintenance. Ceramic isn't a one and done solution. If you value good paint condition and clarity then it's worth understanding and refining your wash/dry process.
      Saying "scratches" is my wording, sorry. I was writing down all the notes from when I met with them & couldn't remember how to say that correctly. (I only have a few VERY small scratches on my car since it's only 5 months old that don't penetrate the paint.)

      There is NO annual maintenance I need to get done by them. The rep said "just do your best to wash it often & wax it once or twice a year and we got you covered for life if you ever get a scratch."

      Wheels off coating.

      Weather permitting, I hand wash my car every week and get a hand-wax every 6 months. My cars are always parked in a garage at home and when at work.


      Quote Originally Posted by proximal View Post
      There's a couple things that stand out about this list:

      1. They don't mention anything about paint correction, which is the most labor intensive thing that should be done before applying a ceramic coating.
      2. 4 layers is at least one too many of the same product.

      PS: I've had great experiences with a place in Anaheim. If you want a recommendation, PM me.
      My bad... I used the wrong wording. Paint correction is included before applying the coating.
      Last edited by HorrorPunk; Yesterday at 03:50 PM.

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      Yesterday 03:53 PM #138
      Quote Originally Posted by HorrorPunk View Post
      Saying "scratches" is my wording, sorry. I was writing down all the notes from when I met with them & couldn't remember how to say that correctly. (I only have a few VERY small scratches on my car since it's only 5 months old that don't penetrate the paint.)

      There is NO annual maintenance I need to get done by them. The rep said "just do your best to wash it often & wax it once or twice a year and we got you covered for life if you ever get a scratch."

      Wheels off coating.

      Weather permitting, I hand wash my car every week and get a hand-wax every 6 months. My cars are always parked in a garage at home and when at work.




      My bad... I used the wrong wording. Paint correction is included before applying the coating.
      I bolded a big red flag here....
      The entire point of a ceramic coating in almost all use cases is so you don't have to wax it (think: long lasting, durable wax). If you're waxing it every 6 months, you're literally not even using the ceramic coating and you just paid a bunch of money for someone to polish the car. To reiterate: you should not have to wax a car with a ceramic coating.
      I also can echo what the other guy said in that usually most of these legitimate coatings (ceramic pro or otherwise) have a stipulation in the warranty that requires you to keep up with "maintenance" washes at an authorized installer of said coating. If it's not that, then it's either something else, or the shop is providing a warranty instead of the coating manufacturer.
      Last edited by iliveoncaffiene; Yesterday at 03:59 PM.
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    15. Member HorrorPunk's Avatar
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      Yesterday 03:56 PM #139
      Quote Originally Posted by iliveoncaffiene View Post
      I bolded a big red flag here....
      The entire point of a ceramic coating in almost all use cases is so you don't have to wax it (think: long lasting, durable wax). If you're waxing it every 6 months, you're literally not even using the ceramic coating and you just paid a bunch of money for someone to polish the car.
      Thanks for that... I have ZERO knowledge on ceramic coating, so my post was in hopes to get advice/thoughts on it.

      Quote Originally Posted by iliveoncaffiene View Post
      I also can echo what the other guy said in that usually most of these legitimate coatings (ceramic pro or otherwise) have a stipulation in the warranty that requires you to keep up with "maintenance" washes at an authorized installer of said coating. If it's not that, then it's either something else, or the shop themselves is providing a warranty.
      Yikes... NO thanks. I'm sure that would cost a lot too!
      Last edited by HorrorPunk; Yesterday at 03:58 PM.

    16. Yesterday 03:58 PM #140
      How does the coating handle power coated wheels brake dust (occasionally use track pads)? Just had a set of wheels refinished and I asked a few local people that detail and one used ceramic pro for around 100 and i got another quote for 300 using one of gtechniqs product. I cant recall which specific product. I've been told it makes it easier to clean, but sometimes I get the salesman vibe from the people I know.

      And does the ceramic coating play well with say a wheel cleaner like sonax?

      Not much of a detailer, but I dont like brake dust, I find washing my cars a tedious process and rather be driving them at the track all day or working on something mechanical where that feels more relaxing to me.

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      Yesterday 04:05 PM #141
      Quote Originally Posted by HorrorPunk View Post
      Yikes... NO thanks. I'm sure that would cost a lot too!
      It's usually a yearly or bi-yearly thing (at roughly $200-300 a pop). This depends on your detailer. It's really not that expensive in the grand scheme of things.
      In general, you're paying for the ease of your maintenance (you don't have to wax it, you can wash it less often). It's always going to be cheaper to do your own maintenance and get the same results - it's just going to take more work on your part more often.

      Quote Originally Posted by Aw614 View Post
      How does the coating handle power coated wheels brake dust (occasionally use track pads)? Just had a set of wheels refinished and I asked a few local people that detail and one used ceramic pro for around 100 and i got another quote for 300 using one of gtechniqs product. I cant recall which specific product. I've been told it makes it easier to clean, but sometimes I get the salesman vibe from the people I know.

      And does the ceramic coating play well with say a wheel cleaner like sonax?

      Not much of a detailer, but I dont like brake dust, I find washing my cars a tedious process and rather be driving them at the track all day or working on something mechanical where that feels more relaxing to me.
      I have Ceramic Pro Strong (also called Wheel & Caliper) on my shiny silver wheels. They still get dirty as hell from brake dust but I just spray some iron-x / de-greaser on them and wipe off all the dust - there is 0 scrubbing involved (unless it's a stuck on piece of tar / tar + rock that I have to get off). They go back to brand new looking without too much effort.
      If I wait too long there is some yellowy build up that requires me to let the stuff sit there longer and maybe a slight bit of scrubbing - but only with a microfiber. I've yet to have to use any type of wheel brush with bristles to clean my wheels.

      The coatings are engineered to stand up to chemicals for the most part, but that being said I doubt you'll need to use any strong cleaner to clean them if they're coated correctly (meaning they took the wheels off and coated the barrels and everything).
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    18. Junior Member nc_detail_garage's Avatar
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      Yesterday 04:37 PM #142
      Quote Originally Posted by iliveoncaffiene View Post
      I bolded a big red flag here....
      The entire point of a ceramic coating in almost all use cases is so you don't have to wax it (think: long lasting, durable wax). If you're waxing it every 6 months, you're literally not even using the ceramic coating and you just paid a bunch of money for someone to polish the car. To reiterate: you should not have to wax a car with a ceramic coating.
      I also can echo what the other guy said in that usually most of these legitimate coatings (ceramic pro or otherwise) have a stipulation in the warranty that requires you to keep up with "maintenance" washes at an authorized installer of said coating. If it's not that, then it's either something else, or the shop is providing a warranty instead of the coating manufacturer.
      Not necessarily. I still wax my car every 6 months despite being coated - Feynlab Self Heal lite. I use Shine Supply Cherry Silica wax. Nothing wrong with that but for clients vehicles I suggest using a different topper every six months or at least annually. I promote the sacrificial layer concept. That said, I suggest and sell CarPro Elixir as the drying aid and CarPro Reload for the 6mo/12mo topper.

      We're expecting a lot from these coatings and multiple years is a long time from a few microns worth of product. Spray sealants just help and slow the degradation and are easy and affordable. I'm very surprised that the shop said they do not need to see the car each year to support the lifetime warranty. That contradicts what I know about CP and from fellow detailers. The point of the annual CP maintenance is for them to apply Ceramic Sport (1 year) coating to achieve the promoted 'lifetime' duration.

      My issues with the 'lifetime' coating or any coating >= 5 years is the paint condition. The car will scratch over time regardless of how diligent one is with their maintenance. I don't see a point in having a protected car if the paint is trashed. Its the fine swirls and rub marks that are the culprit, not the parking lot scrapes that most think will be protected against. For this reason, the longest coating I suggest for my clients is 3yrs. I value paint condition over any coating and steer folks back towards paint enhancements (light polishing) and sealants if I feel it's a better use of their funds given their maintenance habits.

    19. Junior Member nc_detail_garage's Avatar
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      Yesterday 04:43 PM #143
      Quote Originally Posted by Aw614 View Post
      How does the coating handle power coated wheels brake dust (occasionally use track pads)? Just had a set of wheels refinished and I asked a few local people that detail and one used ceramic pro for around 100 and i got another quote for 300 using one of gtechniqs product. I cant recall which specific product. I've been told it makes it easier to clean, but sometimes I get the salesman vibe from the people I know.

      And does the ceramic coating play well with say a wheel cleaner like sonax?

      Not much of a detailer, but I dont like brake dust, I find washing my cars a tedious process and rather be driving them at the track all day or working on something mechanical where that feels more relaxing to me.
      It'll help but it's not a fool proof solution as there isn't one. I charge $100 per wheel to remove/prep/coat/reinstall. It's a time consuming process and all the wheel coatings I've seen/used are rated at 12 months. Cleaning is easier but a cheaper solution would be to use CarPro Hydro2 after each cleaning. This is just another spray on rinse off sealant but it's cheap and effortless. The durability is super short but you're not vesting a lot of time or effort into the application. I have BC Forged wheels on my s4 and re-coat them each year when I swap to my winter setup. If I didn't have the second set, they wouldn't be coated due to the long process vs short life trade-off.

      Sonax Full effect will not hurt the coating. The iron removal agents will only help keep the wheels clean from accumulating brake dust. The better you are at maintaining them, the easier the washing will be going forward

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