Fourtitude.com - Meet the Man Who Uncovered VW's Lie
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    1. Member VeeDubDriver's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 08:31 AM #1
      I know the last thing we need is another TDI-Gate thread, but this is pretty interesting:

      Daniel Carder, an unassuming 45-year-old engineer with gray hair and blue jeans, appears an unlikely type to take down one of the world's most powerful companies.

      But he and his small research team at West Virginia University may have done exactly that, with a $50,000 study which produced early evidence that Volkswagen AG was cheating on U.S. vehicle emissions tests, setting off a scandal that threatens the German automaker's leadership, reputation and finances.

      "The testing we did kind of opened the can of worms," Carder says of his five-member engineering team and the research project that found much higher on-road diesel emission levels for VW vehicles than what U.S. regulators were seeing in tests.

      Daniel Acker | Bloomberg | Getty Images
      A 2015 Volkswagen Golf SportWagen TDI compact vehicle, featuring a clean diesel engine, sits outside a dealership in Ottawa, Illinois, on Wednesday.

      The results of that study, which was paid for by the nonprofit International Council on Clean Transportation (ICCT) in late 2012 and completed in May 2013, were later corroborated by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency and California Air Resources Board (CARB).

      Carder's team—a research professor, two graduate students, a faculty member and himself— performed road tests around Los Angeles and up the West Coast to Seattle that generated results so pronounced that they initially suspected a problem with their own research.

      "The first thing you do is beat yourself up and say, 'Did we not do something right?' You always blame yourself," he told Reuters in an interview. "(We) saw huge discrepancies. There was one vehicle with 15 to 35 times the emissions levels and another vehicle with 10 to 20 times the emissions levels."

      Despite the discrepancies, a fix shouldn't involve major changes. "It could be something very small," said Carder, who's the interim director of West Virginia University's Center for Alternative Fuels, Engines and Emissions in Morgantown, about 200 miles (320 km) west of Washington in the Appalachian foothills.

      "It can simply be a change in the fuel injection strategy. What might be realized is a penalty in fuel economy in order to get these systems more active, to lower the emissions levels.

      Carder said he's surprised to see such a hullabaloo now, because his team's findings were made public nearly a year and a half ago.

      "We actually presented this data in a public forum and were actually questioned by Volkswagen," said Carder.

      The ICCT's research contract to Carder's team was sparked by separate findings by the European Commission's Joint Research Centre, which showed a discrepancy between test results and real world performance in European diesel engines.

      The diesel vehicles chosen for the West Virginia study were the VW Passat, the VW Jetta and the BMW X5. Unlike the VW vehicles, Carder said the BMW vehicle "performed very nicely—at, or below, the certification emission levels."

      West Virginia University is not new to ground-breaking emissions research, having helped create the first technology to measure vehicle emissions on the road more than 15 years ago.

      Carder belonged to a 15-member West Virginia University team that pioneered portable emissions testing as part of a 1998 settlement between the U.S. Justice Department and several heavy duty diesel engine makers including Caterpillar and Cummins Engine Co.

      The manufacturers agreed to pay $83.4 million in civil penalties after federal officials found evidence that they were selling heavy duty diesel engines equipped with "defeat devices" that allowed the engines to meet EPA emission standards during testing but disabled the emission control system during normal highway driving.

      When the news about Volkswagen broke last Friday, Carder heard from some of the heavy diesel engine manufacturers that were part of the consent decree.

      "They saw what had happened and called to say: 'Good job, you guys,"' Carder said. "Some folks said: 'How did they not learn from our mistakes 15 years ago?"'

      Regarding his role in unearthing the current scandal, Carder said there was no particular sense of excitement when his team confirmed that the higher VW emission results were real and not a consequence of faulty measurements.

      "There's no incentive for us to pass or fail," he said. "Obviously, we don't want to see something spewing emissions and polluting the environment. But we really have no horse in the race, as they say."

      http://www.cnbc.com/2015/09/23/meet-...agens-lie.html

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    3. Banned GoHomeBroke's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 08:39 AM #2
      i liked this article except for one thing.

      Daniel Carder, an unassuming 45-year-old engineer with gray hair and blue jeans, appears an unlikely type to take down one of the world's most powerful companies.

      But he and his small research team at West Virginia University may have done exactly that
      makes it sound like David taking down Goliath. like VW is some big bad evil corporation trying to destroy the world, and this guy was all that stood in their way.

    4. Member Unilateral Phase Detractor's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 08:49 AM #3
      Quote Originally Posted by GoHomeBroke View Post
      i liked this article except for one thing.

      makes it sound like David taking down Goliath. like VW is some big bad evil corporation trying to destroy the world, and this guy was all that stood in their way.
      But that's what happened. You don't have to like it, but this guy and his team made a difference on this issue.

    5. Banned GoHomeBroke's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 08:52 AM #4
      Quote Originally Posted by classicjetta View Post
      But that's what happened. You don't have to like it, but this guy and his team made a difference on this issue.
      1) VW is hardly "taken down"
      2) they will most likely follow the same path as every other manufacturer who has been through some serious ****.
      3) i never said i didn't like it. i said the way it's worded made it sound worse than it actually is.

    6. Geriatric Member ByronLLN's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 08:53 AM #5
      Quote Originally Posted by GoHomeBroke View Post
      1) VW is hardly "taken down"
      2) they will most likely follow the same path as every other manufacturer who has been through some serious ****.
      3) i never said i didn't like it. i said the way it's worded made it sound worse than it actually is.
      I get what you're saying. It is a bit melodramatic.

    7. Member Unilateral Phase Detractor's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:01 AM #6
      Quote Originally Posted by ByronLLN View Post
      I get what you're saying. It is a bit melodramatic.
      Such is most news sources that aren't NPR.

    8. Chili Bigot Seabird's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:04 AM #7
      All news is sensationalized to a degree, I don't care what the source is. Some is more extreme than others (Fox News, The Daily Beast, The Huffington Post), and some is more subtle but still present. Even NPR. Never turn off your BS filter and always think critically, because the media won't change. Ever.

      Hell, you know those ancient cave paintings in France? I betcha those animals were really half the size that the hack scribbler drew.
      "First, I'm going to go down on you real slow and make you happy. Then I'm going climb up and fvck you hard." - Gas Prices

    9. Moderator silverspeedbuggy's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:05 AM #8
      "Take down" is heavy handed journalism: I heard an interview on NPR of the guy and he was asked if he felt 'vindicated.' He was very clear in his response that they never intended to 'take down' anyone. He's a scientist and discovered a discrepency and reported it.

    10. Member madrussian's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:05 AM #9
      Quote Originally Posted by classicjetta View Post
      Such is most news sources that aren't NPR.
      Umm, really NPR? That's who you chose for your reference as a non melodramatic unbiased news source? Sheesh....

    11. Member Unilateral Phase Detractor's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:06 AM #10
      Quote Originally Posted by madrussian View Post
      Umm, really NPR? That's who you chose for your reference as a non melodramatic unbiased news source? Sheesh....
      Yes. Are you going to tell me the BBC is way better now?

    12. Member madrussian's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:17 AM #11
      Quote Originally Posted by classicjetta View Post
      Yes. Are you going to tell me the BBC is way better now?
      No. Fox News.

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      09-24-2015 09:21 AM #12
      lol no one really cares, this does little to VW image and its future customers lol


      Last edited by perm; 09-24-2015 at 09:40 AM.

    14. Geriatric Member ByronLLN's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:24 AM #13
      Quote Originally Posted by silverspeedbuggy View Post
      "Take down" is heavy handed journalism: I heard an interview on NPR of the guy and he was asked if he felt 'vindicated.' He was very clear in his response that they never intended to 'take down' anyone. He's a scientist and discovered a discrepency and reported it.


      And that alone is an attention-catching lede.

    15. Member Doug Butabi's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:25 AM #14
      Interesting stuff.

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      09-24-2015 09:35 AM #15
      Quote Originally Posted by perm View Post
      lol no one hardy cares does nothing to VW and its future customers lol
      Can someone translate?
      SS registry owner-emeritus

      Quote Originally Posted by Vee-Dubber-GLI View Post
      NATORabbitCat5PizzaSand

    17. Member Doug Butabi's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:37 AM #16
      Quote Originally Posted by perm View Post
      lol no one hardy cares does nothing to VW and its future customers lol
      Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit5GTI View Post
      Can someone translate?
      "Lol, Ed Hardy doesn't care. This does nothing to his VW and his future customers, lol."

    18. Geriatric Member ByronLLN's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:37 AM #17
      Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit5GTI View Post
      Can someone translate?
      dubs 4 lyfe lol honduh

    19. Member dcmix5's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 09:58 AM #18
      I am sure this guy will be very jumpy around anyone with a German accent for the rest of his life
      Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
      I'm filming this thread. Just thought I'd let everyone know. I've had some bad experiences with threads in the past.
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    20. Member Accidental L8 apex's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 10:01 AM #19
      Quote Originally Posted by madrussian View Post
      No. Fox News.
      As a life-long independent Republican, that's gotta be sarcasm, right?

      Quote Originally Posted by perm View Post
      lol no one really cares, this does little to VW image and its future customers lol


      Almost, one more edit oughta do it.
      Something witty will be in this exact spot soon.

    21. Banned GoHomeBroke's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 10:03 AM #20
      Quote Originally Posted by Accidental L8 apex View Post
      Almost, one more edit oughta do it.
      anyone else see this behind perm's keyboard?


    22. Member RacingManiac's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 10:06 AM #21
      Quote Originally Posted by classicjetta View Post
      But that's what happened. You don't have to like it, but this guy and his team made a difference on this issue.
      Technically I'd think their goal wasn't set out to "take down" VW, they had a study, tried to find some results, and the finding caused VW to be in the hot water. They weren't adversarial in their role to VW, just merely publishing the fact.

    23. Member VeeDubDriver's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 10:16 AM #22
      Quote Originally Posted by RacingManiac View Post
      Technically I'd think their goal wasn't set out to "take down" VW, they had a study, tried to find some results, and the finding caused VW to be in the hot water. They weren't adversarial in their role to VW, just merely publishing the fact.
      But just like Frank Wills didn't intend to take down a presidency, you never know when just doing your job can have huge implications.

    24. Member 155VERT83's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 10:25 AM #23
      I read this story. Apparently BMW has better engineers. The X5 passed the test. The price of used TDI engines should be super cheep now for engine swaps! I'd like a B5 Avant quattro TDI!
      Signature blank...

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      09-24-2015 10:46 AM #24


      Just a pick for the click and because I'm a Mountaineer

    26. Member madrussian's Avatar
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      09-24-2015 10:48 AM #25
      Quote Originally Posted by Accidental L8 apex View Post
      As a life-long independent Republican, that's gotta be sarcasm, right?

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