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    1. Member Visheau's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:04 AM #1
      What say you TCL?

      http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/...ngle_page=true


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      Excerpt

      The typical new car costs $30,000 and sits in a garage or parking spot for 23 hours a day. Zipcar gives drivers access to cars they don’t have to own. Car ownership, meanwhile, has slipped down the hierarchy of status goods for many young adults. “Zipcar conducted a survey of Millennials,” Mark Norman, the company’s president and chief operating officer, told us. “And this generation said, ‘We don’t care about owning a car.’ Cars used to be what people aspired to own. Now it’s the smartphone.”


      Subaru’s publicist Doug O’Reilly told us, “The Millennial wants to tell people not just ‘I’ve made it,’ but also ‘I’m a tech person.’ ” Smartphones compete against cars for young people’s big-ticket dollars, since the cost of a good phone and data plan can exceed $1,000 a year. But they also provide some of the same psychic benefits—opening new vistas and carrying us far from the physical space in which we reside. “You no longer need to feel connected to your friends with a car when you have this technology that’s so ubiquitous, it transcends time and space,” Connelly said.


      iPhone > cars

      I'm 29, I'd rather have a landline than share a weak ass car with a bunch of smelly hippies

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    3. Senior Member Jettavr666's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:16 AM #2
      Quote Originally Posted by Visheau View Post
      What say you TCL?

      http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/...ngle_page=true


      laptop not letting scroll/select so I can't post text

      Excerpt

      The typical new car costs $30,000 and sits in a garage or parking spot for 23 hours a day. Zipcar gives drivers access to cars they don’t have to own. Car ownership, meanwhile, has slipped down the hierarchy of status goods for many young adults. “Zipcar conducted a survey of Millennials,” Mark Norman, the company’s president and chief operating officer, told us. “And this generation said, ‘We don’t care about owning a car.’ Cars used to be what people aspired to own. Now it’s the smartphone.”


      Subaru’s publicist Doug O’Reilly told us, “The Millennial wants to tell people not just ‘I’ve made it,’ but also ‘I’m a tech person.’ ” Smartphones compete against cars for young people’s big-ticket dollars, since the cost of a good phone and data plan can exceed $1,000 a year. But they also provide some of the same psychic benefits—opening new vistas and carrying us far from the physical space in which we reside. “You no longer need to feel connected to your friends with a car when you have this technology that’s so ubiquitous, it transcends time and space,” Connelly said.


      iPhone > cars

      I'm 29, I'd rather have a landline than share a weak ass car with a bunch of smelly hippies
      I'm 31, and enjoy having a car, but its not a must. What is also being ignored here is where people are starting to live. Many people, especially younger people are moving away from suburban living to much more dense urban environments. I live in a 30 story high rise in Chicago. It it wasn't for having a job outside of the urban core I probably would have sold my car years ago.

      The simple fact is cars are expensive, and a lot of work to keep in some circumstances. Gas, insurance, parking all add up, and that's before a car note. In Chicago I take the CTA, or bike pretty much everywhere because parking is a hassle. The simple fact is not everyone needs to drive, and more people are starting to desire that kind of lifestyle.

    4. Member Visheau's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:20 AM #3
      granted, if you live in or very near an urban center vehicle ownership is less essential. But I feel like the article is really ignoring that young people have less money because they spend 5-6 years in undergrad getting into debt for a degree with no job future

      just my thoughts

    5. Member MrRoboto's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:25 AM #4
      Is this news really? It's been talked about for years, it isn't just a problem of millenials. Enthusiasm for cars, especially performance cars, have been in decline for a long time. The golden age of motoring has already passed us by.

    6. Member GLI Dan's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:25 AM #5
      The more I read about my generation the more I fear for the future....meeting a lot of my generation in person doesn't help console those feelings either; all too often anyways.


      On topic, I will definitely always own a vehicle and more than likely be like my father and lease. He leases because of tax breaks, I'll probably do it because I had what i have deemed Car ADD.

      My e46 (much to the credit of my parents) is in my name and paid off. It's a nice feeling knowing that the car is mine and there isn't anything to worry about in regard to that. It could also have something to do with where I live.

      Public transport pretty much stops with the city bus and taxis down here in south florida; aside from the Tri-Rail but that isn't of much help unless you are trying to get to Miami.
      It is also way too humid to bike to work and the streets are not too bike friendly anyway.

      For reference I was born in 1990 and am 23
      Quote Originally Posted by DzlDub View Post
      Cars are ****ing awesome, anyone who doesn't want a car is a communist.
      Disclaimer: Generally, I strongly dislike people.
      Current: 18' Infiniti Q50 Red Sport
      Prior Vehicles: 13' E92 335i M-Sport l 04' E46 330ci SMG l 04' MKIV GLI 1.8t 6spd

    7. Senior Member Jettavr666's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:31 AM #6
      Quote Originally Posted by Visheau View Post
      granted, if you live in or very near an urban center vehicle ownership is less essential. But I feel like the article is really ignoring that young people have less money because they spend 5-6 years in undergrad getting into debt for a degree with no job future

      just my thoughts
      While that is true, statistics still say that overall a college education is generally an asset to ones lifetime earning potential. there are some places where cars are still an asset. I see you are in Alaska, I would ALWAYS have a car there. However, what car sharing and to an extent independent driver services like lyft, sidecar, uberx, etc is allowing people to live in areas where before they would have been car dependent. For example I'm from Pittsburgh, and in many areas of the city its not car "dependent" but if you want to do things like go out at night, or bring a bulky item home you are SOL without a car, however for 95% of the time a person might not need one.

      I have some friends in marketing who have done work for Nissan trying to see what if anything they could do to get 18-24 y/o's to buy more cars, and the fact is they just dont want them, even at rock bottom prices. Like I said before, much of it has to do with people moving into very urban environments.

    8. Member DzlDub's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:32 AM #7
      Cars are ****ing awesome, anyone who doesn't want a car is a communist.
      Quote Originally Posted by AmericanThanks View Post
      Vwvortex is the biggest car forum so I should get atleast 100 enquiries from here. Cars means money.

    9. Member GLI Dan's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:36 AM #8
      Quote Originally Posted by DzlDub View Post
      Cars are ****ing awesome, anyone who doesn't want a car is a communist.
      ...I think i'm going to have to steal this sir.
      Quote Originally Posted by DzlDub View Post
      Cars are ****ing awesome, anyone who doesn't want a car is a communist.
      Disclaimer: Generally, I strongly dislike people.
      Current: 18' Infiniti Q50 Red Sport
      Prior Vehicles: 13' E92 335i M-Sport l 04' E46 330ci SMG l 04' MKIV GLI 1.8t 6spd

    10. Senior Member Jettavr666's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:39 AM #9
      Quote Originally Posted by GLI Dan View Post
      The more I read about my generation the more I fear for the future....meeting a lot of my generation in person doesn't help console those feelings either; all too often anyways.

      My e46 (much to the credit of my parents) is in my name and paid off. It's a nice feeling knowing that the car is mine and there isn't anything to worry about in regard to that. It could also have something to do with where I live.

      Public transport pretty much stops with the city bus and taxis down here in south florida; aside from the Tri-Rail but that isn't of much help unless you are trying to get to Miami.
      It is also way too humid to bike to work and the streets are not too bike friendly anyway.

      For reference I was born in 1990 and am 23
      Honestly I dont know why people becoming more independent of cars is a bad thing for your generation, hell if anything it means people are being more social, and probably meeting in person more, because they are not spending more time in a car, and living further away from urban areas or activity. Generally the people I know who drive are more apt to stay inside than the people I know who rely on public transport.

      Your second part also brings up an interesting point, if it wasn't for your parents would you have a car? Its not cheap, and you very well may have had other more pressing expenses than a car.

      And yes, in your case, and in the case of many sunbelt cities public transport sucks, that is also something that will change overtime. Also as stated before car sharing programs will become more common.

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      11-19-2013 12:39 AM #10
      This has been an issue in Japan for some years now, and it's clear that in urban areas in North America its also becoming prevalent.

      It's hard to argue the economics of not owning a car when you can take Uber/Car2Go/Zipcar nearly everywhere you need when you live close to work. You don't have to worry about finding/paying for parking, street parking damage, higher insurance in urban areas, spikes in gas prices, etc.

      More people I know in their 20's to mid-30's who are single or DINK's don't have a car here (Seattle) than do.

    12. Banned Kumamon's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:42 AM #11
      Quote Originally Posted by MrRoboto View Post
      Is this news really? It's been talked about for years, it isn't just a problem of millenials. Enthusiasm for cars, especially performance cars, have been in decline for a long time. The golden age of motoring has already passed us by.
      Actually we're living in the golden age. We've got cars like the P1, and 918 at the high end, and cars like the Fiesta ST on the more affordable side. Cars are faster, more reliable, more efficient, and handle better than they've ever done before. Gas is cheap in the US right now, and we've still got all the older cars to enjoy, the tech to make them reliable, and lots of information on them available via the internet.

    13. Senior Member feels_road's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:43 AM #12
      Quote Originally Posted by Visheau View Post
      ... they also provide some of the same psychic benefits...
      I don't know about that - my car has never helped me see the future.
      After incessant complaints from a to z, I am now calling all of my characters "special."

    14. Senior Member Jettavr666's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:44 AM #13
      Quote Originally Posted by MrRoboto View Post
      The golden age of motoring has already passed us by.
      THis was going to occur no matter what. Even if we were still awash in cheap fuel, there would be much worse traffic than there is today, and cars wouldn't be any cheaper. You can only pack so many cars and people into a given space.

    15. 11-19-2013 12:45 AM #14
      I'm 23, soon moving to Amsterdam and won't be needing a car.

      I'm still an enthusiast, but gotten over wasting my time and money on cars, I have other priorities.


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    16. Senior Member feels_road's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:49 AM #15
      Quote Originally Posted by I_like_waffles View Post
      I'm 23, soon moving to Amsterdam and won't be needing a car.

      I'm still an enthusiast, but gotten over wasting my time and money on cars, I have other priorities.
      Good choice, then. According to a google search, Dutch waffles are almost as popular as Belgian waffles.
      After incessant complaints from a to z, I am now calling all of my characters "special."

    17. Member Visheau's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:51 AM #16
      Alaska now and Texas for 20 years before here. So, since the 3rd grade I've lived in places where owning a car is pretty essential to 'life' (in a manner of speaking)

      I spend a few days in Chicago this past March and took cabs while in the city, it was nice, but I guess my world view is once where you live in a suburb or farther out so you have to have a car.


      Also, as for education being a predictor of: health, wealth, long life, etc. I know this is statistically true, but I wonder if those figures will change in the coming decades as there, potentially, becomes a dearth of skilled labor like plumbers, electricians, etc. Or as more move to higher education, those who choose to eschew it and learn a trade overtake the college degree'd in earning and 'power' as it were

      The urban life is not something I've lived so it is foreign to me in practice

    18. Member Visheau's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:53 AM #17
      Quote Originally Posted by feels_road View Post
      I don't know about that - my car has never helped me see the future.
      quoted from the article...

    19. Member GLI Dan's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:55 AM #18
      Quote Originally Posted by Jettavr666 View Post
      Honestly I dont know why people becoming more independent of cars is a bad thing for your generation, hell if anything it means people are being more social, and probably meeting in person more, because they are not spending more time in a car, and living further away from urban areas or activity. Generally the people I know who drive are more apt to stay inside than the people I know who rely on public transport.

      Your second part also brings up an interesting point, if it wasn't for your parents would you have a car? Its not cheap, and you very well may have had other more pressing expenses than a car.

      And yes, in your case, and in the case of many sunbelt cities public transport sucks, that is also something that will change overtime. Also as stated before car sharing programs will become more common.
      To your first point, that was more of a general statement and not entirely with regard to this. Visit Elite Daily sometime and lmk what you think.

      Would I have a car w/o my parents? I don't know the definitive answer to that question because simply i am not in that circumstance. I will tell you that I have never had an issue working and saving towards something I wanted/needed. That being said cars have been a passion of mine since I was a very young child so I am of the opinion I believe I would do whatever is necessary to ensure I had a car.

      And yes, it has been changing (new train system to orlando and improvements to bus/tri rail) but it is slow change and at the current juncture just because of city layout I don't ever see it getting too much better. Not without major infrastructure change, which will take many years and even more money.
      Quote Originally Posted by DzlDub View Post
      Cars are ****ing awesome, anyone who doesn't want a car is a communist.
      Disclaimer: Generally, I strongly dislike people.
      Current: 18' Infiniti Q50 Red Sport
      Prior Vehicles: 13' E92 335i M-Sport l 04' E46 330ci SMG l 04' MKIV GLI 1.8t 6spd

    20. Senior Member Jettavr666's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 12:58 AM #19
      Quote Originally Posted by Visheau View Post
      Alaska now and Texas for 20 years before here. So, since the 3rd grade I've lived in places where owning a car is pretty essential to 'life' (in a manner of speaking)

      I spend a few days in Chicago this past March and took cabs while in the city, it was nice, but I guess my world view is once where you live in a suburb or farther out so you have to have a car.


      Also, as for education being a predictor of: health, wealth, long life, etc. I know this is statistically true, but I wonder if those figures will change in the coming decades as there, potentially, becomes a dearth of skilled labor like plumbers, electricians, etc. Or as more move to higher education, those who choose to eschew it and learn a trade overtake the college degree'd in earning and 'power' as it were

      The urban life is not something I've lived so it is foreign to me in practice
      and if I lived in any of those areas I would want a car too. Personally I dont think young people are "anti car" just like I am not, but they also see the benefit of not being dependant on it.

      Hell for example. I was making breakfast yesterday morning for a friend when I noticed I was out of eggs and milk. Had this been even my parents house which is a mile from a grocery store, it would have been roughly a 20 min procedure between getting dressed, getting in the car, waiting at the three lights, walking to the back of a large store, checking out, etc. However, I have a minimart right next to my apartment so instead, I took the elevator down, walked 30 feet, got eggs and was back within 5 mins. I like that kind of convinence

    21. Senior Member Jettavr666's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 01:05 AM #20
      Quote Originally Posted by GLI Dan View Post
      To your first point, that was more of a general statement and not entirely with regard to this. Visit Elite Daily sometime and lmk what you think.
      just read through a couple article titles, and opened a few. I actually kind of like the site. Seems decently informative, and full of more substance than many other sites... I dont see much to fear on there.

    22. Member Visheau's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 01:09 AM #21
      that would be nice, and obviously having stuff that close means the savings of not having a car offsets the, presumably, higher prices of those goods

    23. Member GLI Dan's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 01:10 AM #22
      Quote Originally Posted by Jettavr666 View Post
      just read through a couple article titles, and opened a few. I actually kind of like the site. Seems decently informative, and full of more substance than many other sites... I dont see much to fear on there.
      It's more so all the advice type columns that are directly voiced to the generation and are constantly about relationships and needing to tell people how to manage social media vs. reality. Some of the concerns raised, to me at least, should not be issues and if they are issues for a person I think that person needs to seriously reconsider what he/she is doing with their life.

      The others that are related to current events are typically short, to the point, interesting and informative. Anyway, getting a little Off topic here.
      Quote Originally Posted by DzlDub View Post
      Cars are ****ing awesome, anyone who doesn't want a car is a communist.
      Disclaimer: Generally, I strongly dislike people.
      Current: 18' Infiniti Q50 Red Sport
      Prior Vehicles: 13' E92 335i M-Sport l 04' E46 330ci SMG l 04' MKIV GLI 1.8t 6spd

    24. Senior Member Jettavr666's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 01:14 AM #23
      Quote Originally Posted by Visheau View Post
      that would be nice, and obviously having stuff that close means the savings of not having a car offsets the, presumably, higher prices of those goods
      I mean I would never go grocery shopping there, but paying $2/50 for a dozen eggs vs maybe $1.75 in a normal store isnt that bad.

    25. Banned UsernameValid's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 01:15 AM #24
      21 years old, and I'm up to no less than 4 titled in my name plus many other projects or family vehicles I've driven as my own.

      my generation sucks

    26. Senior Member Jettavr666's Avatar
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      11-19-2013 01:21 AM #25
      Quote Originally Posted by UsernameValid View Post
      21 years old, and I'm up to no less than 4 titled in my name plus many other projects or family vehicles I've driven as my own.

      my generation sucks
      If you are being serious, I fail to see how your generation sucks just because they have different priorities.

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