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    1. Member Uber Wagon's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 04:03 PM #76
      Yeah, I would drive a Kia Soul EV and even a Kia Niro SUV. Compared to its Japanese and American competition, I find Korean cars to be better packaged and styled.
      And judging by the sales figures, pretty reliable too. Korea is the new Japan. Once Chinese cars make it to US shores, Korean cars will no longer will be associated with cheapness.

      Never mind, Mitsubishi does that now.
      Last edited by Uber Wagon; 04-22-2016 at 04:07 PM.
      Beer: The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems.

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    3. Member Uber Wagon's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 04:05 PM #77
      Quote Originally Posted by BLK9GEN View Post
      You may not like the Optima, or any Kia for that matter, but it's not like you don't have to sacrifice just as much if not more more with Honda these days. CVT, cheap interiors, horrible paint, plasticky leather seating, 4 way adjustable passenger seat, etc. If you think the Accord is outright better than the new Optima you either have an overwhelming bias or a very specific set of needs that allows you to only see the good in Honda and the worst in Kia.
      Nah, it's not his fault. TCL made Ross that way.
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      04-22-2016 04:08 PM #78
      I see no reason why I wouldn't buy a Kia. A Forte Koup would fit my needs nicely.

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      04-22-2016 04:10 PM #79
      It would have to be a REALLY good deal, and I think a Turbo Optima or K900 would be the only models I would be interested in.

    6. Senior Member
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      04-22-2016 04:11 PM #80
      Quote Originally Posted by Vicelord View Post
      I often see people driving brand new Kias and wonder to myself why they would buy it
      Because it turns heads when I'm in my penis costume



      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      Resale always matters.
      Not to me. I don't have any car payments and don't plan to

      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      And yeah, not everyone cares about driving dynamics, but this is an enthusiast site right?
      Our gen 1 Soul is fun as hell to toss around, actually reminds me of my old A2 Golf.
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    7. Member dos's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 04:21 PM #81
      My wife bought a certified 2011 Kia Sorento. She loves it more than here past 2 cars(08(?) 2.5 Jetta and 04 1.8t Jetta). Great car which does everything she wants and never had a problem with 99k on the clock now. Why would you look at Kia owners any different from someone who drives a Nissan, VW, Honda, Toyota, Chevy and so on.

      Oh that's right, Vicelord thread, humble brag...
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      Quote Originally Posted by whiteboy1 View Post
      My point that you changing his quote to "prove him wrong" is ridiculous. Obviously we're talking about opinions and different needs. Its as if I'm hungry for a burger and you telling me that having a milkshake is better because you can drink them instead of chew.

    8. Member Fe2O3's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 04:55 PM #82
      I'd purchase a Soul or Forte if the dealers around here weren't all the most sleazy of any brand out there. They all treat you like you're broke and have bad credit at the first handshake. I was looking at a Soul last summer and the first line out of the guys mouth was "Don't worry, we can get you financed." I wasn't dressed up, but sheesh, I don't think I looked broke with no credit
      Quote Originally Posted by phryxis View Post
      sprayed it on, waited some time, and proceeded to go at it with a scraper, some pliers, and a lot of f-ing hard work.

    9. Member BLK9GEN's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 05:13 PM #83
      Quote Originally Posted by Fe2O3 View Post
      I'd purchase a Soul or Forte if the dealers around here weren't all the most sleazy of any brand out there. They all treat you like you're broke and have bad credit at the first handshake. I was looking at a Soul last summer and the first line out of the guys mouth was "Don't worry, we can get you financed." I wasn't dressed up, but sheesh, I don't think I looked broke with no credit
      That is what it's like at the Dodge and Nissan dealers here.
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    10. Member MontoyaF1's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 05:14 PM #84
      Quote Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post
      Wow, I had no idea that Kia owners lived such in such luxurious homes. Times sure have changed.

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    11. Member xo_vw's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 05:47 PM #85
      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      Resale always matters. Most people don't keep the car as long as they think they will, and if you get into an accident while paying the loan down, you could find your wallet in a painful situation.

      And yeah, not everyone cares about driving dynamics, but this is an enthusiast site right?
      An accident will lower the resale of any car which, depending on the downpayment, terms, etc., could put anyone upside-down in a loan.

      Yes it is but we are talking about the average car buyer. I am sure you can look around the forum and find many people - including myself - who enjoy cars but still bought something "boring" and "practical" because that's what our current needs are. We can't all be callmedoc or dave_the_car_guy with Lambos and AMGs in the garage. I hate to pick on you for the Crosstour but I forgot when that became an enthusiast's car.

    12. Member R32Rich's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 05:59 PM #86
      Bought a wrecked one at a Copart auction and flipped it. Only time I'd buy one.

    13. Geriatric Member AKADriver's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 06:01 PM #87
      Quote Originally Posted by VMPhil View Post
      I was looking at a minivan for our children's sitter (working the payment as part of how we are paying the sitter) and the Kia Sedona was the winnar even after looking at Toyota, Honda, Chrysler and Nissan. I'd like to get an AWD Genesis with nav but they make you take almost 10k in options before you can have one and its like Fuuuuuck that. For 50k I am buying an Audi, Merc or Beimer.
      Yeah, after being kind of let down by the current gen Odyssey when it came out, the new Sedona is refreshing. They look great (for a van) out on the road.



      I'm curious how it drives. Reviews seem pretty complementary but they're all driving the top of the line models. I'm curious about the LX, which has different steering (hydraulic instead of electric) and is lighter (by about 300lb).
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    14. Member DonMiguel's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 06:13 PM #88
      A Co-worker of mine has had two different generations of the sportage and the latest one is a lot better than the earlier model he had, but the older one did take a great deal of abuse as a city car in Philly so there is that... But my next door neighbors have a forte coupe and sedan, and they're eeeehhhhhh nice-ish. the coupe reminds me of the scion tc due to the body lines, but they act like the coupe is a sports car, not sure how that one works but to each their own I suppose. I mean they seem a lot nicer than the loaner Nissan Altima my sister had while her accord was at the stealership, if you want to talk about ****boxes the Altima is pretty good place to start.....
      Quote Originally Posted by ATL_Av8r View Post
      What kind of sorcery is this?!?! That car is from 2005-on but that lady, based on clothing, hair, and makeup is from the 80's. Did she time travel??? Or is she just from Ohio?

    15. Member whiteboy1's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 06:15 PM #89
      Quote Originally Posted by rsj0714 View Post
      Because that's what they could afford?

      Kinda a douchy question, No?

      You did see the name of the OP right?
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      Before you take the tact of denigrating a group, you should empathize with the situation/history and understand the facts. It might not make for great debate on forums, but it helps with personal awareness.
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    16. Member Vicelord's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 06:28 PM #90
      After navigating through the **** talking and personal attacks I appreciate the posts here especially from buyers.

      One common thread I'm reading here is "low cost of entry and good resale" but I'm having trouble with the resale claims. If I pull up auto trader there are more kias than I can count and they seem to be listed for higher decreases from original msrp than I feel to be normal.
      Let's argue this the American way; volume, proximity, and repetition.

    17. Member turbinepowered's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 06:33 PM #91
      Quote Originally Posted by Vicelord View Post
      After navigating through the **** talking and personal attacks I appreciate the posts here especially from buyers.

      One common thread I'm reading here is "low cost of entry and good resale" but I'm having trouble with the resale claims. If I pull up auto trader there are more kias than I can count and they seem to be listed for higher decreases from original msrp than I feel to be normal.
      They're usually sold for under MSRP, too. Take that into account and they probably aren't any worse than similar cars.

      Sent from the future via Google SkyNet
      Quote Originally Posted by zukiphile View Post
      There is an area of a normal brain that lets the owner know the object works and needs to be left alone. Not all of us have it. It is like being colorblind.

    18. Member Vicelord's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 06:50 PM #92
      Even if that's true there still seems to be an absolute glut in the market. To be fair it looks like mostly the hamster model (soul) but wow.
      Let's argue this the American way; volume, proximity, and repetition.

    19. Member Sold Over Sticker's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 06:50 PM #93
      Quote Originally Posted by turbinepowered View Post
      They're usually sold for under MSRP, too. Take that into account and they probably aren't any worse than similar cars.

      Sent from the future via Google SkyNet
      Exactly. Depreciation is a percent reduction of transaction prices, not asking prices.
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      Quote Originally Posted by bothhandsplease View Post
      Brendan told me to get the best discount, I had to send dick pics. I thought this was standard car buying practice.
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      Brendan and his all knowing heavy breathing baboon are correct.

    20. Senior Member
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      04-22-2016 07:04 PM #94
      Quote Originally Posted by Vicelord View Post
      I'm having trouble with the resale claims.
      Try google.
      Germans are white people. Look up #84 on the list of things white people like: Gear. Lots of Gear. We even have gear farkles over here. -Atomicalex

      Upon my word I have had as much excitement on a car as in the air, especially since the R.F.C. have had women drivers. -James Byford McCudden

    21. Geriatric Member Hostile's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 07:08 PM #95
      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      Where are their performance models?
      Where are Toyota's or Honda's?

      Quote Originally Posted by mrr197 View Post
      Just went through this with my parents. Outback 3.6R Limited 39,840.
      Who the hell pays almost $40k for a Outback 3.6R...?

      MSRP is $37.3 with the Eyesight package and they routinely sell at invoice which is about $2-3k below sticker.

    22. Member Ross1013's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 07:10 PM #96
      Quote Originally Posted by rconn14 View Post
      I'm sorry.. how does a Crosstour handle better than an Optima?
      I didn't say that. That's a ridiculous thing to say, because everyone knows a Crosstour is a lifted 4000lb burrito with truck tires and could never outhandle a sub-3400lb sedan with its lower CoG and inherent dynamic superiority, not to mention a much lower curb weight.

      But, just for kicks I looked it up.

      http://www.edmunds.com/honda/accord-...t/wrap-up.html

      Quote Originally Posted by Edmunds.com
      From a dynamic perspective, the Crosstour got better. Slalom speed increased by almost 3 mph to 62.2 mph. Around the skid pad the Honda generated 0.80g of lateral force, which was a negligible improvement. Both tests benefited from the stability control system remaining on.
      http://www.edmunds.com/kia/optima/20...ison-test.html

      Quote Originally Posted by Edmunds.com
      There's also more rubber contacting the ground beneath the Optima EX so it came as little surprise when we recorded a higher level of grip — and confidence — for the Kia (0.82g on the skid pad to the Hyundai's 0.77g orbit). We observed similar results in our 600-foot slalom test, where the Optima managed a 62.1-mph best pass to the Sonata's 61.6-mph best.
      So, in case you're having trouble with this (I know I had to read it twice), a '10 Crosstour posted better slalom speeds than both an '11 Optima and Sonata, and better skidpad #s than the Sonata while coming within .02g of the Optima. You were saying?
      Past: '06 Accord V6, '95 Taurus SHO, '01 ITR, '98 Civic HX CVT

      Quote Originally Posted by jamerican1
      Dude, you know you're like the opposite of a purist, right?

    23. 04-22-2016 07:15 PM #97
      Quote Originally Posted by AKADriver View Post
      Yeah, after being kind of let down by the current gen Odyssey when it came out, the new Sedona is refreshing. They look great (for a van) out on the road.



      I'm curious how it drives. Reviews seem pretty complementary but they're all driving the top of the line models. I'm curious about the LX, which has different steering (hydraulic instead of electric) and is lighter (by about 300lb).
      I've had/have a current gen Ody EXL & Sedona LX. Price considered, I like the KIA. Price not considered, I like Kia.

      The Ody is roomier & engine is smoother. Thats about it. The Ody brakes warped the first time I drove it w/ 6 people down the Grapevine. The Ody steering is overly light but u get used to it. The Sedona drives more nimble but is also more coarse in the way the engine revs & trans shifts. It is smaller inside and the center row doesn't come out (but it vertically collapses, which is a plus for us). To get parking sensors on Ody, you need to step up to the Touring trim (which,assuming the likelihood of kids around a minivan and below the sightlines, very needed). I had to add the dealer accessory sensors on my EXL. As with Kia, you can get sensors & other options reserved only in higher trim Odys for cheap on the lower trim Sedona.

      The resale value argument against KIA's is lame & a lazy man's excuse for their confirmation bias: You get less back but you also pay less up front and potentially less during ownership. Compare true transaction price with the operating costs added and deduct the auction price for recent model Kias.

      This isn't 2006 anymore.

    24. Member
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      04-22-2016 07:29 PM #98
      Quote Originally Posted by Vicelord View Post
      After navigating through the **** talking and personal attacks I appreciate the posts here especially from buyers.

      One common thread I'm reading here is "low cost of entry and good resale" but I'm having trouble with the resale claims. If I pull up auto trader there are more kias than I can count and they seem to be listed for higher decreases from original msrp than I feel to be normal.
      What difference does this make?

      To answer your original and highly snobbish question, people buy them because they are good cars that offer great value. It's just that simple. It will take a long time for you and Ross to catch up to what the rest of us learned a long time ago. If you want a good family transport or commuter car, these offer the latest technologies, nice designs, and low cost trouble free ownership. My Optima does not need to get 70mph in the slalom or pull 1.1G's to get me to work reliably. It does it's intended job with ease, grace, poise, and does so with me sitting in comfort. If I want a sportscar I'll get one. Obviously these have other purposes.

      I got mine a year old with 9K on the clock. At 40K miles its been totally trouble free and a breeze to own. Power is fine for commuting, as is the handling. Every car does not need to be exotic or a racecar.
      Quote Originally Posted by Fritz27 View Post
      You're a self-serving Japanese car-hating asshat.
      I drive two Japanese cars.

    25. Member O_loung1's Avatar
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      04-22-2016 07:30 PM #99
      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      The '13 Optima I drove was terrible considering it was a new car. It handled like a mid-90s Corolla and was completely forgettable outside of some cool interior details and a pano roof. IMO no discerning enthusiast should buy one unless the Honda, Mazda, and VW dealers all get hit by meteors and you need a car that day.

      Where are their performance models? Where are the manuals and DCTs? And where are the savings?
      most people on this board will be answering from a driver's standpoint which is fair and understandable. from a commuter's point of view ( riding around town for lunch / coffee in co-worker's vehicles) im impressed with with the kia sorento gdi gen 2.

      my commuter's (driven) choice is : kia sorento gen2 > buick regal (2.0t) > accord sport gen9.
      my driver's choice is: regal > accord > sorento

      the largest problem with the sorento is the issue with the badge and the entire exterior appearance. once you settle in inside, it's quiet, solid, seats are comfortable yet supportive and the plastics look and feel with a high quality texture. from a fit and finish perspective, the sorento feels better built than the quality of the regal and the accord put together, especially the door cards, coming from a dashstroke enthusiast.
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    26. Member Ross1013's Avatar
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      04-23-2016 04:50 PM #100
      Not gonna lie, a little disappointed that rconn14 just dipped out on this thread after I owned his Crosstour bashing.
      Past: '06 Accord V6, '95 Taurus SHO, '01 ITR, '98 Civic HX CVT

      Quote Originally Posted by jamerican1
      Dude, you know you're like the opposite of a purist, right?

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